Chapter of the Week: #57 [Archive]

[cite] Topher:[/cite]I am not denying it is there. What to do with it is another matter. If we must be at the effect of it then let us engineer the effect to our advantage.
Who realizes tribal instinct is the 'puppeteer' when that instinct (or any other) is driving them personally? We only see the tribal instinct in others as they beat each other's brains out. Instinct, when it is triggered, has a way of blinding us completely. As a species we haven't even begun to see ourselves as we are - simple ignorant animals. We are still pretending we are special, e.g., free will, intelligent, wise, sapient, creative, clever, artistic, conscious and aware. Ha! The first baby step to "engineering" is to see things as they are, not as we wish they were. Presently, our ideals and myths drive much of what we think we see. A self fulfilling illusion perhaps?

Comments

  • edited April 2008
    Each week we address one chapter of the Tao Te Ching. The Tao Te Ching can be obscure, especially if you think you're supposed to understand what it's saying! We find it easier and more instructive to simply contemplate how the chapter resonates with your personal experience. Becoming more aware at this fundamental level simplifies life. This approach conforms to the view that true knowing lies within ourselves. Thus, when a passage in the scripture resonates, you've found your inner truth. The same applies for when it evokes a question; questions are the grist for self realization.

    Chapter 57
    Govern the state by being straightforward; wage war by being crafty; but win
    the empire by not being meddlesome.

    How do I know that it is like that? By means of this.

    The more taboos there are in the empire
    The poorer the people;
    The more sharpened tools the people have
    The more benighted the state;
    The more skills the people have
    The further novelties multiply;
    The better known the laws and edicts
    The more thieves and robbers there are.

    Hence the sage says,
    I take no action and the people are transformed of themselves;
    I prefer stillness and the people are rectified of themselves;
    I am not meddlesome and the people prosper of themselves;
    I am free from desire and the people of themselves become simple like the uncarved block.


    Read commentary previously posted for this chapter.
  • edited December 1969
    [Note: I italicize phrases I borrow from the chapter, and link to phrases I borrow from other chapters to help tie chapters together. While making it more tedious to read, :? the Tao Te Ching is best pondered in the context of the whole.

    Life necessitates action. The extent we are either straightforward or crafty tells us about the true nature of our actions. The less stake I have in an outcome, the more straightforward I'll be. Conversely, when I [chref=22]contend[/chref], I'm tempted to be crafty. And what is war but simply [chref=8]contending with[/chref] something in hopes of winning our way?

    Victor Mair puts it this way: Rule the state with uprightness, Deploy your troops with craft, Gain all under heaven with noninterference. Here, craft feels a little less 'loaded' than crafty, but it still amounts to the same in the end. I sometimes feel I'm at war when dealing with the plumbing around here!

    Only when I have no stake in an outcome am I truly able to be [chref=16]impartial[/chref] and win the empire by not being meddlesome. The ironic thing is that such letting go feels like loss - big time. In the end though, we win the empire! It is so simple; we gain what we give up; we lose what we cling to. Even though we may [chref=70]understand[/chref] this to be so, instinct always pulls us in the other direction, and drives us to [chref=75]set too much store by life[/chref].

    The more benighted the state? Mair puts it this way: The more clever devices people have, the more confused the state and ruling house... Clever devices, Sharpened tools! Oh, if the author/s of the Tao Te Ching could see civilization now! But truly, it is only a matter of degree. A stone axe was a clever device at its time and no doubt confused matters. The inherent 'problem' lies in how we look to externals to bring about [chref=45]Great perfection[/chref]. We're looking in the wrong place - external innovation rather than internal deliberation - which just leaves us confused in the long run.

    I see the 'cause and effect' relationship in all these points except the last, i.e., The better known the laws and edicts, the more thieves and robbers there are. Clearly, laws and edicts are symptoms of a social disconnection that produces thieves and robbers. More broadly, laws and edicts only reflects the tenuous nature of 'mega' society. 'Mega' meaning any group larger than a few dozen individuals.

    Finally, I take no action and the people are transformed of themselves. Mair puts it as; I take no action, yet the people are transformed of themselves. By the same token, I am free from desire yet the people of themselves become simple like the uncarved block.

    But, of course 'they' aren't transformed, are they? Rather, free from desire, my perception is transformed enough to allow me to see 'it' like 'it' is. Only when my desired ideals of perfection are out of sync with nature does [chref=45]Great perfection seem chipped[/chref]. It all rests in the eye of the beholder, obviously! What we see when we look is ourselves. Thus, [chref=47]without looking out of the window, one can see the way of heaven. [/chref]
  • edited December 1969
    I only know the Lau translation - who is this Mair person (careful not to say guy)? Not too sure about those 'yet's seems to change the sense of it quite a lot - would my hero Lau approve? And, and, and...
    I was drivelling on elswhere about how you folks (I remember now, I was having a dig at Hayduke (is it?)) take advice about statecraft as advice about how to live your lives. Surely that part of the poem should be seen as political treatise and not as personal philosophy?
    Sorry, I seem a bit negative in my contributions so far (I am hungry) but then so is the poem; it's all not this and not that and so forth.
    Best,
    BlackSheep.
  • edited December 1969
    Welcome Mr Blacksheep. It is good to have you on board. I'll just pool your points here and reply, starting with the last...
    [cite] blacksheep:[/cite]so I've sat here for about a day... ... help on chapter 13 - and ch.31&46 come to that.
    * A day? Patience... [chref=16]stillness[/chref]! After all this is supposedly a 'Taoist' site. Re those chapters: First see the posts and we'll go from there.
    [cite] blacksheep:[/cite]
    * ...how you folks take advice about statecraft as advice about how to live your lives. Surely that part of the poem should be seen as political treatise and not as personal philosophy?

    * Sorry, I seem a bit negative
    * What is the state but an extension of the family, and what is the family but an extension of the 'self'? Integrity (Te) comes from within our 'self' and determines how we deal with our 'self', with our family, with our state. Our transactions, whether personal or public and political, hinge on simple rules of nature which Tao Te Ching does a pretty good job of pointing to, considering that our biology hoodwinks us a every turn. Hoodwinking is one of those 'rules'.

    * I love it. Stirs the pot. And besides, negative and positive [chref=2]complement each other[/chref]. Though granted, we often only want the later. Biology [chref=65]hoodwinking[/chref] us once again. Now least you think 'hoodwinking' is not referring to biology, I'd just point out that it is biology that 'Of old excelled in the pursuit of the way'
    [cite] blacksheep:[/cite]
    * Is it worth putting my hand in my pocket for a new Lao Tzu? I'm very happy with my 1963 DCLau - does the Ma Wang Tui thing add much that I should want to see?
    * I suppose that depends on how [chref=21]shadowy, indistinct, indistinct and shadowy[/chref] you wish to 'see'. The Ma Wang Tui, along with Zhongwen are excellent tools if wish to make it all a bit more [chref=15]Murky like muddy water.[/chref]
    [cite] blacksheep:[/cite]
    * ... seems to assume that Taoism (like some other isms) is to be judged as a thing to run your life by
    * Anything and everything (but especially isms) can lend itself as guidance "to run our life by". That would be due to our hierarchical nature. We need 'alpha male' to set us straight. Isms are nothing more than cognitive based 'alpha males'. The Tao Te Ching bows out of that game right off the bat in chapter 1 when it says,

    [chref=1] The way that can be spoken of
    Is not the constant way;
    The name that can be named
    Is not the constant name.[/chref]

    On the other hand, what it points to may be useful in showing us how [chref=53]easy[/chref] the way is.
    [cite] blacksheep:[/cite]
    * Lao Tzu is an anthology, not an author.

    * You were not meant to use it as advice on how to bring up your kids.

    * Please forgive me...
    * When we sense the [chref=14]thread running through the way [/chref] we are 'Lao Tzu'. We are the 'author'. If, [chref=39]in virtue of the One[/chref], we are of like mind, does this still make it an anthology? Perhaps we are the author though we inhabit separate bodies over many millennia, yet we are One when we [chref=22]embrace the One[/chref].

    * The Taoist perspective was an invaluable tool in raising my kids. Nature works the same at every level of existence. [chref=56]Mysterious sameness[/chref], if you will. That we don't see the 'sameness', is due to our own [chref=70]ignorance[/chref] and personal agendas, i.e., lack of [chref=16]impartiality[/chref].

    * No way! Keep it up! :)
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